Note that whenever I say plaster, I actually mean wallpaper paste. Sorry for the confusion!
hey sara,thanks for the video its realy helpfull.i tried the same method on single tissue and it works well ! the paper is thin,crisp and hold shape. but i didn't use wallpaper paste,instead i use white adhesive.(because their widely sold in almost every store) it's called Fox Glue
instead of plaster can i use elmers glue and instead of tissue paper can i use the thin japanese paper
Can I use a mirror instead of the glass ? I would just try it.. But I don't want to ruin my mirror :)
I was making double tissue for the first time using non bleeding tissue form origami-shop.com and when i was putting the glue on to the paper it didnt seem to go right through so i made the consistency of the glue like water and then it was better and i got alot of wrinkles.
Please tell me what i am doing wrong. thanks
I am getting a lot of wrinkles in the paper! How do you keep it smooth? I tried several times and got somewhat less wrinkles with practice, but still not none. (do i just need a lot more practice? are yours wrinkly?) My tissue paper is non bleeding, but the mc soaks through just fine, so I am doing both layers at once as in your video. I tried it with a smaller piece of bleeding tissue paper and got less wrinkles, but still some. I tried to stretch the tissue as I applied the mc and still it wrinkles. Also, how stiff is the finished paper supposed to be? Mine is pretty floppy. I really need this to be perfect, cause I want to make Satoshi Kamiya's ancient dragon!! Is this paper good for his unicorn and pegasus, too?
Yes, I also have small wrinkles, but I don't think they distract, neither while folding, nor in the completed model. I have also noticed that with some tissue paper I can get almost totally wrinkle-free double tissue, with others it's much harder to get few wrinkles. It might have been coincidence, but indeed I found it easier to work with the bleeding tissue I have vs the non-bleeding tissue I have.
As to the finished double tissue, it should feel much stiffer than before treating the tissue paper. But of course, it's still very thin paper, and thus will be a bit floppy. Also, the more you handle the paper, the softer it will get again. Try washing your hands before folding - and perhaps in-between - and don't apply cream.
I haven'f folded the unicorn, but think both models will also work nicely with double tissue. They may not require it as much as the ancient dragon, though. Also, you may have to strengthen the paper more in the leg area (on the folded model) if it's too weak to carry the weight of the rest of the model.
I went ahead and folded the pegasus (love it!) and yellow bird (in red), before your reply, and the wrinkles were not a problem as the models became quite small.
I made another piece of red for the dragon (the previous one i had brushed too much so that it had thin spots so i could only cut it into small pieces) and it stuck to the glass quite firmly. I had a very difficult time removing it and it has many large tears along the edges because it stuck so much. However, I had used a much thicker mc mix for it (the back was quite shiny too), which i think is the problem, and also have not cleaned the glass from previous papers (though that did not affect the removal of several other pieces).
Just wondering if you know where I can buy relatively large rolls of tissue. I've searched a lot, but can't find out where they sell that material
What do you mean by relatively large? I think it's quite common to get 50cm by 70cm sheets. When I was in England and bought my first tissue paper, it actually came in rolls, I'm guessing around 50cm width.
Something between 50 and 100cm would be good. Where did you buy it though? Like what kind of store
Ah, it was in a simple crafts store around the corner. :)
Sorry, I don't know an online source.
Aww, that's too bad. I'll just keep searching then=)
can i use pva glue instead of plaster for the mix?
I've tried this with thinned-down PVA glue once. I got a couple more wrinkles, but that was perhaps because it was the first try, and I was also using other tissue paper. The result itself was good, so: yes, you can also use PVA glue.
It will have a somewhat different effect on the paper, I found the paper to be a bit stiffer - which can be good or bad. :) I didn't fold with the paper, so can't really say.
what do you fold out of "double-tissue"
honesty i like tissue foil WAY better but i was courious what you make out of it.
I like double tissue for complex models. See three folds from double tissue here:
HI Sara Didn't think my oldest would like this, but he loves it. still very basic and the finished job is not that great but think we will bith be getting some practice in over christmas.
this is what we should get our children to do not TV and Games consoles..,.
Yesterday I made the double tissue, but I used the glue and water technique that you used in Making Tissue Foil Instructions. It's a little bit sticky; is that alright to fold with?
I've never tried treating double tissue with white glue, so I cannot say. MC does not leave any stickiness.
If that's what the paper is like when it's completely dry, I'd just try and see whether it works ok. Actually, you may want to only lightly press the paper together while you're folding, and press it together strongly once the paper does not need to move anymore. This may play out to be an advantage, fixing the model a bit.
hi sara, how much table spoons i have to aply in 500 ml, thats all, ty
Honestly, I don't know. And it's different depending on which sizing you're using.
In my case, I just make a mix and if it's too thin, add sizing. If it's too thick, I add water. Actually, I store a thick mix and then thin it down to needs.
thank you Sara,
is that a friend of mine happened hydroxymethyl cellulose powder, to prepare and then implement it, is that the tissue paper does not hit, or stay with a top layer, which is why I ask you to describe how to do the mix.
I'm not sure what went wrong. Here are three ideas:
1. I don't know whether hydroxyethyl cellulose works as well / worse / better than methyl cellulose. I'd assume it works ok, but I do not know. Maybe it is the powder itself that is not suitable.
2. It may be that the mix was not strong enough, i.e. too watery. I use a mix that has a consistency of raw egg-white, so it's quite thickish.
3. It may be that the solution did not soak both layers. This may especially happen if you use non-bleeding tissue, which doesn't soak through with water as easily as bleeding tissue. Ensure that both layers are soaked with the solution, else they will still be separate when dried.
Wet folding allows you to fold the paper in a greater degree. If you saw weard realistic origami then it mayby the help of wet folding.
what is wet folding????????????????????????????????????
In wet folding you dampen the paper before or while folding it. (Or, actually, after folding, but before/while shaping). This changes the behavior of the paper and you can thus get other results. For example, if you only make soft creases with damp paper, then you will not break the paper fibers. Once the paper dries this means it's much stronger than if you'd folded it in a dry state (and thus broken the fibers). It's also useful for bringing paper into rounded, organic shapes that will stay like that over time. In wet-folding, it is important that sizing was added in the paper production process, or you prepared the paper with sizing (e.g. by applying MC).
This is just a very rough description, you can read lots more about it on many pages.
Hello Sara! Well, just finally made my first "double tissue" and was wondering if you can gie me SPECIFIC models that is good for this paper... I know that the dragon, eagle, and hydragea are great models for this paper, but PLEASE tell me what models(specifically) are great for this paper... Oh, (haha) make sure the models you are going to tell me are going to have diagrams online or videos online... PLEASE reply! AWESOME work on this video by the way! Thanks!!! =D
tarantula designed by robert lang tutorial by jonakashima
As you mentioned, the hydrangea by Shuzo Fujimoto works beautifully with double tissue. Insects usually turn out best with double tissue. Anything of high complexity will usually work quite well with double tissue, actually.
When cut to small squares, double tissue is also suitable for most simple and intermediate models. For example, I folded Quentin Trollip's pig from double tissue, and it worked like a charm: http://www.happyfolding.com/gallery-trollip-pig
A no-no are models that need thickness to the paper. Don't do boxes, and most modulars won't turn out well with double tissue, either.
As to specific models, in the end there are many. My advice is: just give it a try. Experiment and find out for yourself which paper type you like best for each model. In my opinion exploring choices is an exciting part of origami.
would normal school art paste work?
my tissue paper has little peices of bark stuck on it when i bought it.
can i still make double tissue paper?
waiting for your reply
Making the double tissue should work ok. However, folding paper that have pieces of bark or thick paper fibres can be a challenge. In the end, giving it a try is the best way of finding out whether it works for you.
do you know any place where can i buy tissue paper in Sydney?
Sorry, I don't. But searching the web suggests for example this source:
They have a showroom in Sydney (448 Botany Rd, Alexandria
NSW 2015, Australia), so you might want to give that one a go. You can also check art/craft supply stores.
Sara i made some paper when i try to cut it it's getting ripped but i tried to cut on the galass surface is that the problem?
I haven't cut on a glass surface before, I always use a self-healing matt. If the paper rips, maybe you have to press the ruler harder on the paper. Also, it might be that your knife doesn't have a sharp enough edge - possibly it needs a new blade? (I use an Exacto knife.)
As to cutting on glass in general, I think I'd be concerned the glass breaks or gets scratches in the process.
As a side note, I use a steel ruler. This makes it easier to cut cleanly, as the knife will not accidentally cut into the ruler.
Thanks for the reply Sara but where did you found those?The cutting matt and the exacto knife
Most arts and crafts stores should have them.
Great videos Sara, thank you.
After searching high and low for a week and a half, I finally found 'wallpaper paste' in Ontario, Canada (for those who are looking), at:
(canadian tire, home depot, wallmart (lol), Michaels, and several arts and crafts stores did not store such products.)
Thanks for sharing this information, I'm sure many will appreciate the reference!
Hi Sara i let the paste to rest about 2 hours and the bubbles haven't gone yet what to do?????Do i need to let more?
I let it rest over night, so it had a good 6 or 8 hours to rest.
Thank you Sara i did but i also thin it down a bit and now it alomost looks like yours. Thanks for the reply!!!
Nice video. Can you wetfold double-tissue?
When I think of wet folding, I always associate it with using slightly heavier paper. I don't think you could do it with double tissue, I'm guessing it would turn too soft and rip. However, I have dampened the folded model and then given it its final shaping, and that works well.
Thank you for the reply.
Nice video, I'm just wondering where you got your templates for making the squares.
Some of them come from origami packs I bought. The largest one (48cm square) I had cut to my requirements in a hardware store. The hexagonal template I cut myself, but I should be getting metal ones anytime soon (very exciting!).
In general, you can always make your own templates. I've found the best (ie. most accurate) way of doing this is as follows:
1. Print the desired shape on paper. [Use a program, which allows you to draw a shape very accurately. I use Inkscape, a vector graphics program - see http://www.inkscape.org]
2. Tape the paper to cardboard, and cut along the printed lines.
3. Template done. :)
Hope this helps,
My paper nearly always sticks to the glass at the edges resulting in the paper tearing, am I using too much paste?
Thanks for any help
i tried it again and a lot of the bottom sheet sticks to the glass, please help !
(im sorry if these are silly questions , but if gotten to a point were i need thin paper and i cant buy it anywhere, so being able to make this paper would be great:) )
I'm not sure what the problem is.
1. Basic: Have you tried using a thinner solution? Have you tried using a knife or something of the like to separate the edge of the paper from the glass? Also, have you let it dry completely?
2. Paper choice: it might be that you're using non-bleeding tissue and that the solution is not penetrating the second sheet. In that case, try applying the solution between the two sheets, i.e. spread one tissue on the glass, then apply the solution, then spread another sheet of tissue on top. Try applying the second sheet of tissue as seen in the tissue foil video, or stretch in on another surface to then apply it in one go. Both methods try to avoid too many wrinkles in the paper when applying.
Also, if you're using non-bleeding tissue it might be worth applying quite thin solution, letting the paper dry, and then applying another layer of thin solution. It will take more time, but maybe applying more of thin solution will penetrate both layers, and doing it twice or so will give it enough strength.
Thank you soooo much :)
Approximately what ratio of water to MC do you use? The paper seems to go quite dark in the video, whereas mine does not. Also, my paper tends to curl with MC. Do you know what my problem is? Am I not putting on enough MC? Thanks in advance.
- - -WhisperPuffin
I just made another sheet and it started cockling wildly and it went all crinkly. Do you know what's wrong?
Re water - MC ratio: Hm, I'm not sure. I've got a thick paste, which I store, and water it down before I use it. I go for an egg-white similar consistency. Depending on what I want to fold from the resulting double tissue I'll use higher or lower concentrations, actually.
Re crinkly paper: I usually apply some pressure to the edges of the paper (by pulling them out a bit) while applying the MC. This prevents it to form waves while applying the MC. I usually have small air bubbles here and there, but these basically disappear while the double tissue is drying. [I remove larger air bubbles with careful brush strokes - move the air to an edge.]
Thanks a bunch!
This doesn't work for me:(
It's not the video, the videos fantastic!
I do exactly what you do, but my two sheets don't stick together.
Has this ever happened to you?
Would you know anything I'm doing wrong?
Thanks for any help .
There are three problem sources I can think of:
1. What glue are you using? It might be that it's not suitable for making double tissue. The most important ingredient is methyl cellulose, which is often used in wallpaper paste.
2. How thick is your mixture? You need to add enough glue. If you're using methyl cellulose, go for a consistency similar to egg white, i.e. quite thickish.
3. Are you using nonbleeding tissue, i.e. does the paper bleed colour when it gets wet? If it doesn't bleed colour, the paper might not be soaking with the glue mixture when you apply it. Then try the following: Spread one sheet of tissue paper, then apply the glue mixture, then apply the second sheet of tissue paper. Check my video on making tissue foil for one way of applying that second sheet. Another way, which might work better in this case, is to stretch the second sheet on a wooden plate and then apply it in one go. This might help prevent ripping and wrinkles.
Thank you !!!!
it is non bleeding so I'll try what you said :)
Which Methyl cellulose is better?
Instant clear Jel or clear Jel?
Here I found it:
PS: Can I use one of these or is something else better? Maybe this one?
The first two don't look like they'd be suitable at all for sizing paper. The third link seems to be pure methyl cellulose, which should be the right stuff.
Thank you so much.
Can crepe paper be used for this?
I have tissue, it's just that the only place I found
It is 2 hours away!
I honestly cannot say, because I haven't tried. The only comment I can make is that crepe paper is usually quite wrinkly, and probably not very regular. In that the resulting paper will probably not be as crease-free and regular as when using tissue paper. Also, you only have to go to that shop once, buy a batch, and then be happy for a long time. 2 hours doesn't seem too daunting for me. Just combine it with a small trip to the city.
The only thing is that I'm only 14 and we don't go there that often:)
you can use elmers glue i tried it and i made my first double tissue
Can I use the same glue like I use by Tissue Foil?
PS: I´m german. You can answer on german.
It's better to use wallpaper paste ("Kleister"). See the comment below as to how you may use white glue instead. Note, though, that it will be harder to work with, and will not give as nice results as when working with wallpaper paste.
Ok thanks for help.
Thanks Sara! I'm an amateur folder still in my formative stages of origami complexity. I very much desire to fold more detailed models but I've had a really hard time finding the appropriate sized paper with the right consistency. Most origami paper that I find at hobby stores or in art stores only come in 6 inch (~15cm) sizes and aren't strong enough to accommodate the many folds (the vertices at which the folds meet start to develop holes! -_-). I'll give this a try sometime. Thanks again!
Can i use white adhesive .
It has the following properties:
can be soluble in water
goes transparent after drying
I will wait for your comment
White adhesive sounds like sticky, gooy stuff - which should be perfect for making tissue foil. For double tissue you should go for wallpaper paste that is sold in powder form. It has to be stuff that will be absorbed by both sheets of paper, so that they join. So it's more liquid than the glue you use for tissue foil.
What will happen if we use white adhesive instead of wallpaper paste?
will go waste?
I need your reply to proceed with my origamis
Waiting for your reply
Please reply soon and clear my doubts
I think using wallpaper paste delivers better results for double tissue, and that white glue is better suited for tissue foil. Having said that, you can use white glue for double tissue. In that case you should probably alter the directions as follows:
1. Put one sheet of tissue paper on a glass surface.
2. Apply the white glue, watered down appropriately.
3. Now put a second layer of tissue paper, aligning it with the first one.
4. Maybe brush over the second sheet of tissue to ensure that it bonds with the other sheet. To avoid ripping the tissue use a brush, rather than your hands.
5. Let dry completely before removing from glass surface.
The disadvantage is that it's quite hard to avoid wrinkles when applying the second sheet of tissue paper (step 4). It helps to roll the tissue paper onto something, and then roll it on the first sheet of tissue paper (see tissue foil video), or to stretch the tissue on a board and then apply it in one. I haven't tried the second method, but for double tissue it might deliver better results than the first method.
do you enjoy making double tissue
It's not that they are THAT expensive - but the temptation to buy everything is huge :)
Keep up the videos !
So, I went there. Nice place. I bought a bit of paper. *cough cough*
The guy immediately gave me a catalog to take home with me.
Nice video !
You'll find non-bleeding tissue foil when you get back in Munich at Cartapura - or at least the closest thing there is to such foil.
Take a thick wallet with you though :)
Thanks for the tip, I'll check it out the next time I'm in town. As to thick wallets - ah, there's no harm in at least having a look around.
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